IMO, if you like to write those kind of stories, who cares, but those that read them stories.
Stories in SOL are invariably good to better, unless squicked by codes, I would not rate stories really bad.
I know some authors like to withold info for their stories, well, for my favorite authors, I usually didn’t read the codes much, except just to make sure, since each author has his/her own trademark, (rache, no need to worry about your stories, they are safe enough for me )
Lazeez, I think you did a good job into making SOL enjoyable to all, I think if there are less readers because of what was out of your hands, then they are wankers, since it cost people time and money to host the stories up, it cost time and money for the authors to churn out stories.

I think that’s all.

Lazee – overall a good idea. I enjoy reading stories that parallel my own experiences – there’s a good deal of If Ony or What If going on I suppose.
Equally I am revolted by coercion, but that’s me. I once walked (quietly) out of a graphic scene in a stage production of A Rake’s Progress. I felt ill, and the ushers said that happened every night. But it re-affirmed who I am, and I could make the choice – stay or go.
The worst experiences in life are when we feel ambushed, be it missing story codes or telemarketers.

Hey Laz

Great job with the entry!

One quick addition – It should say stories with SEX with under 13. Now it says stories with under 13…..

Thanks for that! I chose filtered.

Great idea, always been a bit anxious that Big Bro might someday dig up my past on this site &c. Doesn’t seem to be working, though – I opted for “Filtered” and decided to test it, but could still read the pedo story “Daddy does Amy” at http://storiesonline.net/story/63963... it was coded gi, pedo and lolita.

Hm. My bad, disregard my previous post. pls. or moderate it.
But my point still stands. The stories where there is no plot but pedo fucking and sucking should be not coded (and filtered) the same way, as stories which has some stuff that is part of the storyline.

I could have sworn you already had a check list to block certain types of stories under readers preferences. If so readers dont know how to use it or its just for subscribers or limited in blockage. If its just for subscribers and the people requesting filters are not tell them dont like it too bad. Pertsonally i check the codes on the stories if I dont like the codes I dont read it and move along, and there are a bunch I dont like but some are vital to the plots and or theme or emotiional feelings expressed in the stories. Before I see a movie I read the description watch the traiors or commercials to see if it appeals to me or not, reading is the same thing. Then again the requests for change could be minors or young adults who dont want to believe some of the sick and depraved stuff in the stories doesnt happen in reality. We all know most of it does happen some where in the world. As I said read the codes if you dont like it move on or go to another site for your reading pleasure.

Oh, and on another point…. I noticed that some people were admitting that they rated stories down just for content…. that is not acceptable in the slightest.

You should vote something down based on whether it is a good story, NOT just because of content.

The debate brings up many issues. First, the reading of fictional stories with underage characters engaged in sex has not so far been held illegal, so far as I know, as long as the stories do not contain pictures of actual children. Neither has the writing of them. I don’t know if the same holds true for non-fictional stories, or those including or referencing real life children; the line might get hazy at that point. If someone chooses to not read stories with children in them, that is their business. For those who enjoy that type of story, it’s their business. Let the readers decide, and if someone is making moral judgments and ending their membership, it is their business, and not one that should affect us. I just recently joined after many, many years of reading stories here daily because I want to support this site, even though there are lots of stories I don’t enjoy. If I don’t like something, I don’t read it.

I understand those wanting to know all codes up front. However, as a writer, I don’t always know where my stories are going to take me when they start. If you start reading an incompleted story, you take the risk that the story will go where you don’t want to go. It’s your responsibility and on your shoulders if you begin an incompleted story and find you don’t like it as you go along, to stop reading. You might make up your own alternative story path. When reading, I often get one or two or three chapters in, and abandon the story because it’s yet another harem story (I don’t like harem stories). I won’t tell anyone to not write or post harem stories, but I’m pretty bored with them, they don’t move me, and I don’t want to read them unless something else in the story line really intrigues me (What’s all the fuss about? – the mind talking thing really gets me interested).

There is a deeper question: Is the story intended to titillate using children as the stimulus? Lots of children inhabit the stories here on SOL, and the total numbers of those included for sexually stimulating purposes is quite small. Lots of stories just happen to have the child running into the parents’ bedroom or peering through the cracked open door when the parent is having sex, thus exposing the child to sex (even if they don’t later join in). Where is the line drawn? Plus, what if the inclusion of sex is NOT intended to titillate. For instance, I am writing a long serial, which I would not post until completed, of my own childhood which included sexual abuse, and its affects on my life. The sex is horrifying and meant to be depicted as it was, for the purpose of clearly demonstrating how those incidents led me to be very self destructive, and later to climb out of the mire and become successful despite the trauma. Without understanding the devastation, one cannot truly understand the redemption. Blocking all story children under 13 would be throwing out the good with the supposedly undesirable.

And all this begs the question: what if it IS titillating? I don’t want to read it, but I’m not here to tell anyone else who they can and can’t be and read, only that they don’t unreasonably hurt someone else in doing so. Having someone accidentally “hurt” by finding themselves in a story or a site that has children involved in underage sex isn’t a big enough hurt because the reader can walk away from that story. Do we ban rape stories? How about piss or scat? Snuff? Harem (my personal dislike)? Gay? Bi? Cheat? Are we only going to accept married and monogamous heterosexual couples having vanilla sex in missionary positions and for the purpose of procreation? Well, why not? Where do we stop? How many writers do we shut down, or put in isolation? Eck.

The codes are enough. Let the category search get rid of pedo stories for those who don’t like them. However, the pedo code should ONLY be used where sex with children is intended to titillate.

Transdelion

Transdelion I agree with you but it all comes back to interpritation who says what is what and I honestly cannot believe that Laz screens and reads everything posted on SOL. Like religion it all comes down to however the reader interprets the writting.

The pedo and Lolita codes could be eliminated entirely. They’re pointless for purposes of filtering. If someone is going to be offended, what matters is whether a sexual situation includes a person under 13. What difference does it make who initiates the sex? The codes gi and boy are enough. On the other hand, if you want to be more helpful in terms of guiding readers to the fantasies they’d like, you’d be better off coupling “b” and “g” with the partner letters, thus: Mb, Mg, Fb, Fg for adults with kids; mb, mg, fg, fb for teens with kids; and bg, bb, and gg for kids with each other. Then use the other codes, like mult, cons and noncons the way you do with older characters.

First off, I have to Agree with J.J.’s post above. Why do we need the pedo and lolita codes at all? If you pair up the boy and girl tags like you do the f and m tags, which now, solely indicate teenagers, that should be enough to tell people what to expect in that story. I don’t know about others, but, when I go to find a story, the tags I look at first are the pairing. So, in my case anyway, using the boy and girl codes to show pedo or lolita would actually better for me since they are what I pay attention to first and most.

Second, I have to take issue with Moxie’s above statement that they are somehow going to criminalize fictional stories about sex with children. Before they criminalize writing about sex with children, I think they would need to criminalize writing about murdering somebody. Good thing Stephen King’s retired. If he wasn’t, this would pretty will put him out of business.

How can you criminalize writing about sex with children and then not criminalize writing about murder? If you criminalize writing about crime… Murder, rape, robbery, assault and so forth… you won’t need to worry about it. Nobody will be writing…. Anything except technical manuals.

First off, add another vote to JJ’s suggestion about paired codes (Mg, Fg, Mb, Fb, etc.); that simply makes far more sense.

In regards to the use of the category exclusion function, I should point out that function is NOT available to registered but non-paying users and perhaps that should be a feature that is universal to all.

I would add that I don’t think that there’s been a HUGE proliferation of these kinds of stories, as Lazeez’s original post on the subject and apparently the people complaining to him have suggested. I mean, the way the subject was presented with such alarm, you’d think that pedophilic stories constitute a SIGNIFICANT percentage of new posts, which they clearly do NOT. It’s not as if every second, third or even fourth story has that kind of content in them.

I don’t mind the solution that Lazeez has implemented but I get the feeling that this will not satisfy those who raised the objection in the first place. If people are so worried about being caught with stories that are objectionable or illegal where they reside, then they should do their own due diligence and delete the offending story, including clearing the cache of their web browser. And if you’re stupid enough to download such a story on your computer at work, then you deserve whatever fate comes your way. I mean, come on people: take some responsibility for yourselves.

I honestly think the best way to handle both this problem AND the problem about people rating stories based on content, is to simply open up the story filtering options to regular members. Those that don’t like pedo, or violent, or whatever, would filter them out and never see them – and those that write them would no longer be dragging around low scores just because they write about controversial topics.

Barring that, which I guess is unlikely to happen, I’d love to just see a similar option to filter away the no or minimal sex stories, because I am getting pretty tired at seeing how the site is getting overrun by those.

I think filters are great and can’t see why not to expand on them. Yeah, freedom of speech and a filter does not stop that from happening. I find that I don’t look for new story but just authors I can already trust.

Oh and everyone does not include the appropriate codes because in the past I have openned stories that failed to list subject matter contained heavily thru-out their stories not in the codes.

So some don’t come back and others (like me) on go to Authors they know for new stories or not at all. Invest in additional filters. Would make alot of us even happier without impeeding on others right to write

While some have advocated removing the lolita and pedo codes, they should stay. While I don’t generally read any story with either code attached, those that DO like that type of content will use those codes to determine if a story is the kind they like.

A person that likes stories with underaged kids, but only if the kid is the aggressor, will want the lolita code. And conversly, those that want the kid to be a victim of an adult aggressor will want the pedo code. The fact that those codes have been used when the kid is a teenager instead of a pre-teen may be a problem.

Really, Lazeez is in a no-win position here, and he’s done the best he can do with the pile of feces that had to work with. Yes, the amount of more extreme pedo stories on here bothers some. What Lazeez is trying to do shouldn’t offend anyone. The people with non-paying accounts may one day become paying customers, so it helps to try and reach a middle ground.

Breaking this down into a conversation about how codes should be used, and what other codes should be changed, is fruitless. There have been hundreds of code discussions over the years, both here with SOL’s discussion group, and the a.s.s.discussion group. It was rare in the extreme to see a concensus form, and only after a lot of feelings got hurt. Let’s not go there any more than we’ve already done. Seriously.

Conrad Wellingham wries that there are many things worse on SOL than pedo – this may be correct, but unfortunately in this day and age it is the pedo that law enforcement agencies worldwide appear to go to great lengths to try and stop. And their preventative methods don’t just stop at the person ‘doing the act’ – they usually back track along the entire chain to grab anyone who is remotely connected to that pipeline.

So it isn’t a case of ‘murder is illegal, so lets stop murder stories’ – you (usually) can’t be charged with being involved by reading about it or looking at it. This cannot be said of pedo activities though – whether physical or by reading.

And therin lies the problem for many – tainted by the brush is a very real and conceivable issue for Lazeez to consider.

Thank you. A lot.

Some authors have turned off the voting because they disagreed with the (within the last year or so) change to how the voting works, making older stories have their scores reduced based on a weighted scale.

It’s the author’s work. If they don’t want scoring, that’s their biz. Heck, some of them have turned off reviews. I was quite bummed when a nicely written story that I was quite enthusiastic about had the reviewing turned off.

I my self feel that as long as the story is just a story and the author does not state that they approve of the acts I see no problem with this story type.

I like SOL mostly the way it is how ever if every one would be honest about content of their stories so every one would know what is in what stories then if they don’t like it all they have to do is just not go there and no one can complain about any one else s kind of story no mater what it is.

Thanks. It does seem that recently that type of story was taking over and I must say that I was considering going some place else. It had got to the point where I was worried about guilt be association. How would I answer the question, ‘Why do you post your stories on that site?’ and Let’s be honest the ‘It didn’t used to be this bad’ answer doesn’t really wash.

Your solution is the right one, you have not censored these stories, but you have allowed for self censorship.

So long as the stories are pure fantasy and remain so, then I would defend the rights of their authors to write and post them, but the rights of the rest of us not to be tainted by association should also be respected. Personally I would ask that the separation were made so by default and that unfiltered access was only available by explicitly turning it on. It doesn’t have to be an ‘I am a pedo’ Button, you can sugar-coat it by all means, just so long as no one could have any doubt as to what they would be exposing themselves to.

I am adult enough to decide if I want to read a story or not, and while reading, if I find it distasteful I can stop and go elsewhere anytime. I worry that someone on a witch-hunt will prosecute me for my choices of reading material. I choose this site because of the freedom of choice it offers.